Version 6.41 Pre-Burst Incorporation

[Patrick_Kennedy]

Hi There!

I have a problem with pre-burst application in version 6.41.

I wish to incorporate the ARR data hub pre-burst depths and so I tick the box ‘Use ARR data hub pre-burst depths’.

Nothing happens so I click on the ‘Edit Pre-burst depths’ button and then the values do appear in a new window as percentages from my data Output file from the ARR. That’s good, but when I click OK nothing appears in the cells in the original window.

Thinking that it might still be ok with ‘Use ARR data hub pre-burst depths’ ticked, I press OK and return to the Design Rainfall Specification Window. I then press OK but then I cannot proceed because two error messages pop up saying ‘Pre-burst temporal pattern not available for 18 hour duration’ and ‘Pre-burst temporal pattern not available for 30 hour duration’

I have checked my datahub output file and it does have preburst depths for 18 hours but admittedly no 30 hour depths. Interestingly, if I just wished to ‘Use default pre-burst patterns’, there are no depths for 18 and 30 hours.

Am I missing something, or using this function incorrectly? Or has anyone experienced a similar issue? I would appreciate any help or insight!

Thanks,

Pat

[Benson Liu]

Hi Patrick,

When you say you ‘nothing appears in the original window’ are you referring to the Edit Pre-burst Temporal Patterns dialogue box? If so and it is empty is the ‘Use default pre-burst patterns’ checkbox ticked? If it isn’t ticked then RORB is expecting you to manually enter in pre-burst temporal patterns and by leaving it empty there are no pre-burst temporal patterns and it would give you that error when you try to run it.

If this isn’t the case would you be able to email me a screenshot of the window so I can take a look? My email is benson.liu@dev7.preflight.com.au.

Kind regards,

Benson

[Patrick_Kennedy]

Hi Benson,

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, I do mean the Edit Pre-burst Temporal Patterns dialogue box, and the ‘Use default pre-burst patterns’ checkbox isn’t ticked, so I believe from what you said that I do have to enter the temporal patterns manually then. My concern is that I am not sure what the standard procedure is regarding inputting the the pre-burst temporal patterns. Pardon my ignorance, but where are these procured from? I do not believe they are included in the data hub file?

Thank you for your concern,

Patrick

[Benson Liu]

Hi Patrick,

I’m afraid that there is not much guidance for pre-burst temporal patterns in ARR2016. The data hub does not to my knowledge provide pre-burst temporal patterns, it only provides pre-burst depths. By default RORB has pre-burst temporal patterns from the GSAM for long duration storms and pre-burst temporal patterns from Jordan et al., 2005 for short duration but you would need to decide whether these pre-burst temporal patterns are suitable for your catchment or not. My understanding is that if you are running short duration then the pre-burst temporal patterns from Jordan et al., 2005 should be fine. If they are not suitable then I’m afraid I cannot give you much advice on how to derive pre-burst temporal patterns.

Kind regards,

Benson

[MoAzmi]

Hi Benson,

When you refer to Jordan et al., 2005 and GSAM, how can I access to the original data? Obviously it is impossible to extract pre-burst temporal pattern data from papers’ figures and I have not been successful to directly extract from the RORB. Is there any chance to have standard pr-burst temporal patterns from you (i.e. an excel file).

I appreciate your help.

My email address: mo.azmi@calibregroup.com

Regards,
Mo

[Benson Liu]

Hi Mo,

I’m afraid I can’t send you the standard preburst temporal patterns, but the original data from GSAM is available from the Bureau of Meteorology and the Jordan et al., 2005 paper is available online. In the paper there is a table of values for the preburst temporal patterns and I believe the paper also details the data it was based on.

Kind regards,

Benson

[hamid.ghajarnia@gmail.com]

Hi Benson

I am using the RORB version 6.45. The RORB release note says when we decide to edit the pre-burst rainfall it should come up with the default values, whereas, the default values are incomplete in my RORB and model comes back with an error massage. Would you please let me know if I am doing something wrong or that is a bug?

Thanks

Hamid

[Benson Liu]

Hi Hamid,

The default values of pre-burst temporal patterns are only available for some standard durations. The durations that RORB is able to run are dependent on the design rainfalls you input, so that is why not all the durations come with default pre-burst temporal patterns. If you only wish to run durations where default pre-burst temporal patterns are provided, you will need to delete the durations from your rainfall data which do not have default pre-burst temporal patterns.

The default pre-burst patterns are only there to serve as a guide, as there is not much guidance on pre-burst temporal patterns in ARR2019 you will need to decide whether the default patterns are acceptable for your catchment and what pre-burst patterns to use for the durations where they are not provided.

Kind regards,

Benson

[roloko3965]

http://doramasmp4.ec/

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